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Sandy no on consolidation


JimmyPete
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If everyone wants to be a big city then I suggest you move to Pittsburgh.

I do not live in Sandy but I own a house and 5 lots in it. I do not want consolidation and if it did end up on the ballot I would not get a vote even though I own property in it. 

If anything Dubois should become part of Sandy Township and not the other way around. 

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8 minutes ago, Gator11 said:

If everyone wants to be a big city then I suggest you move to Pittsburgh.

I do not live in Sandy but I own a house and 5 lots in it. I do not want consolidation and if it did end up on the ballot I would not get a vote even though I own property in it. 

If anything Dubois should become part of Sandy Township and not the other way around. 

The whole consolidated  area could be called Sandy Township but everyones postal address would say DuBois as it is now.

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Supervisor, Resident Plan to Revive Proposed DuBois/Sandy Consolidation

 
 
 

UBOIS – A Sandy Township supervisor and area resident have plans to revive the proposed consolidation of the township and DuBois City.

Supervisor Sam Mollica and resident Barry Abbott revealed their plans for a citizen’s petition at Monday night’s DuBois City Council meeting. 

The proposed consolidation effort was terminated earlier this month when the supervisors voted, 4-1. Mollica was the sole vote in favor of consolidation.

“I really don’t want to see it end,” Mollica said.  “The other option available to us is to have a citizen’s petition.”

 

https://gantnews.com/2021/06/30/supervisor-resident-plan-to-revive-proposed-dubois-sandy-consolidation/

Screen Shot 2021-06-30 at 7.45.12 AM.png

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12 hours ago, Petee said:

Here's your map of what is DuBois and what is Sandy Township.  Now look at why they want the land.

 

 

 

Who exactly is "they"?  Are you expecting the feudal lords of DuBois to swoop in, lay claim to all the the eye can see, and turn Sandy residents into peasants?

 

If you gathered 20 random people from DuBois and Sandy chances are good you could not tell their place of residence.  There is no "us" and "them".  The concept of DuBois as a wealthy, greedy pocket of crime whereas Sandy are merely simple, pleasant country folk eking out a unobtrusive life is utterly ridiculous.

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the closer comparison may be Benzinger/St Marys , rather than ( depressed areas of ) Spangler/Barnsboro........that being said I`m not aware how either joint venture is viewed by their respective peoples . ,,,,,,,,any one have that insight of favorability or not ??..

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The Township is huge.   You could go from Luthersburg or outside of Sykesville to 3 miles out of Brockway  without even leaving the township .   Consolidation. would work if you had accurate and fair zoning. But we know that will not be regardless of people saying, yes, it can be done.  History has proven that.  Just like 219.  

At the time the powers to be did lay with the City. And they continually didnt support 219.  Now the shoe is on the other foot in regards to the land area.  I think Petee is right on this one. They need to present a detailed zoning plan. You dont vote to consolidate just to consolidate. My advice is if you want it is to actually get involved. Go to Supervisor and City Council. And ask them about the Zoning plans for consolidation. 

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1 hour ago, doingfine said:

the closer comparison may be Benzinger/St Marys , rather than ( depressed areas of ) Spangler/Barnsboro........that being said I`m not aware how either joint venture is viewed by their respective peoples . ,,,,,,,,any one have that insight of favorability or not ??..

I think your post makes a Great point and sense. But the difference is that Dubois/ Sandy is located in a major transportation cross roads hub .  219 is a major North-South road. I80 East and West.   322 Alternate East and West. Railroad access.  Over the last 50 years they realized this but never enhanced it. And that is why big potential companies have wanted to locate here but saw the bickering and red tape they had to go through with local government .  Same thing now. But the shoe is now on the other foot for  land control.  

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18 minutes ago, jaman said:

. My advice is if you want it is to actually get involved. Go to Supervisor and City Council. And ask them about the Zoning plans for consolidation. 

The zoning would be the same as it is now.

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1 hour ago, doingfine said:

the closer comparison may be Benzinger/St Marys , rather than ( depressed areas of ) Spangler/Barnsboro........that being said I`m not aware how either joint venture is viewed by their respective peoples . ,,,,,,,,any one have that insight of favorability or not ??..

 

Screen Shot 2021-06-30 at 10.36.58 AM.png

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1 hour ago, jaman said:

I think your post makes a Great point and sense. But the difference is that Dubois/ Sandy is located in a major transportation cross roads hub .  219 is a major North-South road. I80 East and West.   322 Alternate East and West. Railroad access.  Over the last 50 years they realized this but never enhanced it. And that is why big potential companies have wanted to locate here but saw the bickering and red tape they had to go through with local government .  Same thing now. But the shoe is now on the other foot for  land control.  

"Major"?  That's a stretch.  Ok, I-80 is that.  But, 322/219/119 are not.  They are single lane country roads that are far away from anywhere.  They would need complete overhauls to become "major".  

Want business to move here?  Provide cheap and reliable labor with minimal taxes so the corporation can maximize profits.  This area has cheap/reliable labor.  The taxes part is the issue and it stretches far beyond a tiny DuBois/Sandy Twp squabble.  

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25 minutes ago, Cacao said:

"Major"?  That's a stretch.  Ok, I-80 is that.  But, 322/219/119 are not.  They are single lane country roads that are far away from anywhere.  They would need complete overhauls to become "major".  

Want business to move here?  Provide cheap and reliable labor with minimal taxes so the corporation can maximize profits.  This area has cheap/reliable labor.  The taxes part is the issue and it stretches far beyond a tiny DuBois/Sandy Twp squabble.  

The Sandy Township water rates are a major problem too.

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54 minutes ago, Cacao said:

  But, 322/219/119 are not.  They are single lane country roads that are far away from anywhere.  They would need complete overhauls to become "major".  

  

Exactly.  And you just made the argument I have been saying for years about 219.   I have stood at the Sheetz in Brockway. It is a major "country" road . 75% of the truckers are out of state or Canada. And most people know it has been a major transportation route for drugs, too.

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27 minutes ago, Keyser Soze said:

The Sandy Township water rates are a major problem too.

Sandy has spent $$$ on improvements where the $$$ was not intended to be used , now Govt mandates Sandy get projects moving forward ( sewage being 1 example , not rain water runoffs that were neglected for years )

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1 hour ago, Keyser Soze said:

The Sandy Township water rates are a major problem too.

How are they compared to other parts of Pennsylvania?  Cheap labor costs and local taxes might offset, or even exceed, the water/sewage expenditure.  That was the case for Danone.  

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18 hours ago, Keyser Soze said:

Please read the report!

 

Pages 27 through 30 covers  the real estate taxes.

The post consolidation uniform millage rate and the additional service millages are less than currently levied in both the township and the city. The highest post consolidation rate of 17.60 mills for all services is less than the 2021 city rate by 5.9 mills and 0.65 mill for the township. For those sections of Sandy that do not have street lighting or hydrant services, the millage reduction will be 2.19 mills based on the 2021 township millage of 18.25.

 

Residents who have well water and/or on-lot septic systems will have a reduction in their real estate tax bills but will not have a change in their water and wastewater systems due to the consolidation.

https://sandytownship.net/media/files7/2/Final Report Sandy Dubois 03.31.21.pdf

All right, now more of the same.  Once people understand the changes and see them written simply, it may happen without problems.

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20 hours ago, DuB814 said:

If consolidation happens, I vote that we give you an acre of land and rename it Petee Township. You can plant your crops and herd your farm animals in your own municipality. We will just build our sky scrapers on the border of your municipality. 

Your answer was rude and directed at me, not the discussion at hand. Give an intelligent answer,  not an insult.

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19 hours ago, Gator11 said:

If everyone wants to be a big city then I suggest you move to Pittsburgh.

I do not live in Sandy but I own a house and 5 lots in it. I do not want consolidation and if it did end up on the ballot I would not get a vote even though I own property in it. 

If anything Dubois should become part of Sandy Township and not the other way around. 

Fallacies! No ones said they wanted a big city. 

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Guest Township Resident
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It doesn't matter which side you are on, it should be on the ballot and let the voters decide, not just a select few.

That's the way I feel as well.  I can't believe there isn't more outrage over the abuse of power displayed by the four supervisors in voting against the will of the people.  

People have posted solid arguments both for and against consolidation but I would love someone to post a logical argument to not have the question on the ballot.  Anyone?

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