steelnut

7 hours ago, LFG said:

If there were any attraction to bring me to PA, that would be it. I would absolutely love to see an Ag show with that many exhibitors. There are rural parts of SC, but the Ag shows here are severely lacking. You have to go to TN to even start getting into the big time chicken shows. I could spend days walking round a show like that

The Farm Show is amazing! I'm with Petee, I hate that it's in the middle of winter in PA

I want more investigations. They are a huge corporation, 600,000 probably doesn't mean as much to them as the bad publicity.

On 11/6/2017 at 5:29 PM, LFG said:

I hate egg eaters, that's a tough habit to break. We are right at 24 weeks on our birds, and I've had Marans take 26-27 to lay. Hopefully by Thanksgiving

Did you get any eggs? I love this thread!

2 hours ago, larry01 said:

BRANDY SMOKED TURKEY: I tried this for THANKSGIVING and it was great. I had a 20 pound turkey and thawed it. I injected with the following marinade.3 cups Christian Brothers BRANDY $10 + 1/4 cup orange juice+1/4 cup vegetable oil 3 Tablespoons bacon drippings. Inject the day before smoking. RUB RECIPE: 2 TBL. ONION powder+2 Tbl. of orange juice, brandy, bacon drippings, salt, pepper,and brown sugar. Add more or less ingredients to suit yourself. Put rub on turkey and put in smoker. I have a MASTERBILT 30 inch electric smoker. I put a disposable foil pan half filled with a 50-50 mixture of apple juice and water on bottom rack below turkey. I used apple wood and smoked at 225 degrees until internal temperature reached 165 degrees.

Thanks so much!

5 hours ago, TucsonSunset said:

Its quite believable, sadly. 

It's just so wrong. Total disregard for employee's lives.

I saw this on WJAC today, unbelievable!

On 10/20/2017 at 11:43 AM, LFG said:

From what I hear this story is not over. The last I heard DEP had another driller in taking samples. I wanted to post today because I actually met with one of our sludge producers this week for the first time at their facility, and I have a better understanding of where it comes from, how it is solidified, and why certain materials have to be used. This will be kind of a long and boring post, but for anyone wondering what sludge actually is I will try and explain it.

Wastewater treatment sludge is easy to visualize, it's just whatever settles to the bottom of a treatment pond, and it makes up about 40% of our sludge intake. The rest is classified as "industrial sludge", so in my mind it was coming from the back end of a plant as the sludge I see. I asked our hauler if he would give me a tour of the facility, because we have to work with each other on haul times so I'm not bombarded with more than I can handle in a short period of time. Sometimes this puts our hauler in a bind, so I wanted to see what he was up against. I was surprised to learn that his facility isn't producing the sludge, he is taking liquid waste from all kinds of industry, solidifying it, then sending it to the landfill. When I say liquid waste, I mean almost any liquid you can think of. Oil, ammonia, shampoo, milk, all different kinds of liquid chemicals. He said almost every manufacturing process produces liquid waste on some level. His facility receives these liquids and what can be recycled, like oil, is recycled. All other liquids are hauled in tankers, or in 50-100 gallon totes. These liquids are dumped into a "solidification pit", a concrete lined pit about 15ftx15ftx10ft deep. The next step is to add a binding agent, and this is where the dangers of sludge in a landfill begin. Sawdust is commonly used, and I love it, but the problem with using sawdust is it doesn't totally bind the liquid. If only sawdust was used, the trucks would leak from the facility all the way to the landfill, about 45 miles away, so other binding agents have to be added. One option is a cottony looking material that soaks up the liquids, and that works for me because the liquid is squeezed back out in the landfill by the weight of the equipment and the weight of the trash stacked on top of it. Picture it like a saturated sponge. The problem there is you still risk trucks leaking en route, so another agent they use is binding polymers, basically powders that lock the liquids. This is the stuff that makes sludge so hard to handle, so dangerous if it isn't mixed properly. The very thing that makes it safe to haul is what makes it dangerous in a landfill. It's not like a sponge, it doesn't release the water. It never dries and stabilizes, and if too much is placed in one area it makes an impervious layer that will trap other liquids either above or under that layer, creating those invisible underground ponds that I've described before.

This is why I want the story of Greentree to come out. If it is proven that sludge was responsible for that collapse, the waste industry needs to take a long look at what it is, and what it is doing to us. Liquid waste will always be generated, and it has to go somewhere. Modern landfills are the best option we have at this time, but the workers in those landfills have to be protected. When "wet waste" studies are done, they are done by engineers, and those results are shared with upper management. The field operators are not brought in to the discussion. Things that look good on paper don't necessarily translate to good practice in the field. One of my engineers came to me after one of those studies, excited to tell me they had proven that the "moisture retention capabilities" of the polymers were very high. To the people watching the bottom line, what that means is less leachate generation, less liquid at the bottom of the landfill that has to be hauled off and treated. An engineer doesn't think about what this waste that never dries does to the surfaces we work on every day, and how those initial savings in leachate generation turn into expense exponentially for years and years after the waste is dumped. You have to dig up bad areas and repair them, you have slides that if not repaired turn into exactly what happened at Greentree. You have odor issues because of gas migration, and lawsuits have been settled for millions of dollars with neighboring communities. The biggest issue of all is the instability it causes, and the dangerous conditions employees have to work in if it is not handled properly. There needs to be a national discussion about how this liquid waste can be safely disposed of. You can't dump free liquids in a landfill, so it will always have to be solidified in some fashion. I want the industry, regardless of the company you work for, to take a look at this issue and make common sense decisions that include input from the people that actually have to handle this material. It can't be fixed by a spreadsheet.

If the Greentree collapse doesn't get everyone's attention, then nothing will. If it is swept under the rug and disappears quietly, it will happen again

I so agree with you. I don't want anyone to forget what happened or stop asking questions.

I know lots of folks love autumn, I do too, but to a point. I hate that everything is dying. I love spring when everything is coming to life. I had my annual cry in my garden this week. It's just so sad that it's almost over and we have to wait until next May to plant again, 8 months away.   

We just finished a little while ago doing two batches of canned tomatoes, my favorite! I just wish we could get some warm nights!!!

5 minutes ago, shameless978 said:

not hourly we aren't we work a lot of overtime we are working 12+ hrs/day and not to clean up managements mess we will be working 12+ on our every other sat so dont say we are well paid because hourly its pathetic and we only get the cola for raises got nice raise couple years ago like 6% but took away our bonus that just made up for our shi%%y raises we have no incentive program at all.

Over the years, I've talked to employees, I know that you aren't paid "well". And with the danger involved, I feel for all of you. Pro or anti union, you folks need one. Then you would not be threatened with loss of your job for coming forward about the danger involved. I don't want this story to fade away, I hope that WJAC keeps on it. And I want to say thank you for your honesty and for what you do in the environment that you have to work in. 

I'm going to try again for smoker recipes? It will be soon time to put the smoker away and I'd like to try some different things before we put it away for the winter. TIA!

17 hours ago, lavender said:

Tell me about it! That is about the time we moved to DuBois. The first year I got nothing because of the groundhogs and then for two or three years we ripened tomatoes in the basement and on windowsills because nothing ripened in the garden. We did get beautiful cabbages and broccoli though. Now the tomatoes ripen and the peppers grow but the spring crops are iffy. The climate seems to have changed in the last 20-30 years. 

Shhhh, don't say climate change!! Just kidding, but I agree with you. This August was weird, usually I'm not fond of it because I'm warm blooded and hate humidity, but wow at the temps we've been having. I feel for those wanting to enjoy their pools.

15 minutes ago, lavender said:

The cold nights aren't helping the tomatoes ripen and my eggplant is just starting to blossom. Going to be darned lucky if the weather holds long enough to produce eggplant. 

I know, we need some warm nights! I remember way back, maybe 20 or more years ago, we had the same situation. We picked all of the tomatoes and put down newspapers and laid them all out in a single layer and then covered them. They did ripen but it took time. And I just don't like the thoughts of it, I'd rather they ripen naturally, on the plants.

1 hour ago, landfillguy said:

That's assuming the employees knew how dangerous it was, or didn't want to go back up there. It is management's job to know what is happening in that landfill, and if the employees weren't afraid, then it wouldn't have come up in a union meeting. I understand what you are saying, but a union doesn't decide what happens in a landfill operationally. If that landfill were unionized and the employees went on strike, there would be operators brought in from other landfills, possibly from anywhere in the nation, to keep the operation running. You can't just close a landfill, it would impact every home and business within a 75 mile radius. There are contingency plans for a strike. The landfill has to operate

After listening to the cell phone calls between a couple of employees that WJAC aired, I think that they were very afraid. And one worker spoke to Kody from WJAC under anonymity because he was afraid of losing his job. I have to agree with Micheal, if unionized, the employees wouldn't have to be afraid of exposing what was going on. They all saw the danger and that it was building. Most of these guys live paycheck to paycheck, they don't get good wages from AD and they have families to support. We've talked to four of them, they were all afraid. And they're still afraid of speaking out because they need their jobs, it's just a really sad situation. I was so hoping that something would be done, but a 12000 fine just doesn't cut it. For a life lost and they're just really lucky that many more lives weren't lost that day. 

9 minutes ago, landfillguy said:

Don't forget the hurricanes, though. You have to take the good with the bad

Oh I know, I don't like storms at all and I absolutely HATE humidity! July and August here are usually really humid, but this August is very weird, we have temps way, way below the average. The low tonight in some areas will be in the 30's! I think in DuBois in the 40's. It doesn't bother me at all, but my garden needs some warm nights.

3 hours ago, landfillguy said:

I have purposely been avoiding this thread because of the geographical difference, but it was really interesting reading. Finally getting ripe tomatoes on Aug. 28? Lord, by the first of August I'm ready for everything to just die . I usually plant just before or on Easter, everything is beautiful in June, and by August the thrill is gone. Now it's time to start thinking about the Winter garden, which interestingly enough sounds like what you guys just call a garden. Leafy greens, cabbage, cauliflower, broccoli, etc... You can't grow that stuff in the summer down here, it does best in the fall and early winter. I'll plant in September, have fresh broccoli casserole for Thanksgiving, then a good supply of kale, turnip greens, and collard greens until it all warms up and goes to seed in the spring. I even plant 2 patches of kale just to keep the chickens in something green through the winter

 

Now quit yer bragging :)! Hubby's best friend is from Alabama and he's always talking about his two gardens every year just to make me drool! But he does bring me up fresh peaches every year, so all is forgiven.

I wonder if Advanced Disposal/Greentree makes political contributions? I'm too tired to look tonight.

3 minutes ago, landfillguy said:

Ours is 4 years old with 7000 miles on it. She drives my truck if weather conditions aren't perfect 

I can understand buying a 2500, but not repeatedly. The point of having a diesel is to put some miles on it

Ours is a 1986, old one, but in great condition. Hubby is on-line many nights looking for another one, to me one is enough.  My favorite of hubby's 2500's was the 2005, I loved that truck! But he had to trade it in to get another one 2009 and then the last one in 2014...LAST ONE!!!

I take back that the 2005 was my favorite, actually the very best of his trucks was the 1992 Silverado, it was the smoothest ride ever. I think I shed a few tears when we gave it to our son. He no longer has it, but it's still on the road, we see it all the time.

9 minutes ago, landfillguy said:

We don't have kids, so our cars are what we splurge on. I have my truck, my wife has a nice Vette. People see that Vette and make the stupid "You can't hide money" remark, but they don't give the truck a second thought. People don't realize new diesels cost more than a new Corvette

We have a Vette too, it's an old one but we love it, it's our splurge I guess. It's never driven in bad weather, which we have an abundance of up here. We hear the same kind of comments. One child, grown and with a family of his own. So we're at a point of thinking we did our job and now we can actually spend money on us sometimes. Now that doesn't mean that I want hubby to get another 2500 Silverado...no, no, no!!!

On 8/28/2017 at 11:56 AM, landfillguy said:

My truck before the King Ranch was a 2008 Silverado 2500HD. I should have kept that truck, pre EGR and DEF, sweetest driving and riding 3/4 ton I've ever been in. I'd be all over one of those if I could find one with lower miles, even if the price is still up there

Hubby will only have a Silverado 2500, I've tried to talk him into a 1500 numerous times, but no way! Good grief, they are so expensive

10 minutes ago, Petee said:

Have you ever tried trellising all the vining crops?  It's amazing how much better they do.

Yes, we trellis the peas, sugar snaps, cucumbers and the cantalope.  We had to pull the peas about three weeks ago because of the powdery mildew thing and now it's onto the squash. I did research it and there are varying opinions.

22 minutes ago, Gator11 said:

peppers done fairly well. I did not lpant many. Tomatoes are doing great and so is the celery.  Watermelons I have a half dozen or more of a couple varieties. Picked my last onion tonight. Wahhhh. This is the first time I got onions to grow bigger than what I started with. 

We just planted the last of the onions on Saturday, we love green onions, so I buy a lot of them and as we pick, we re-plant them. We didn't do watermelon this year but we did plant cantaloupe and they're doing really well. You just never know with a garden from one year to the next, it just keeps us on our toes!

I'm finally getting tomatoes, hoping to get enough for a couple of loads to can. Peppers are crazy! I'm going to do a couple of loads of them in the next few days. At least one in evoo and vinegar and one in evoo and sauce. I already did two loads of refrigerator pickled peppers. And we stuffed a bunch and froze them. The cukes are about done. And my squash aren't looking too happy either. My peas got this white film on them so we pulled them early and now the squash has the same thing, so we're going to pull them. I hope everyone's gardens are doing well!

3 minutes ago, Petee said:

Those who work there are pretty well paid, and finding another job like it would be a problem around here.  

Actually they aren't paid that well at all for the danger that they are put into on a daily basis.

On 8/23/2017 at 5:19 PM, landfillguy said:

I plead with the employees to make a stand over this. I know some of you guys are reading this thread, and the opportunity is slipping away. I'm just some guy on the internet, what I say goes only so far, and I can't say too much for fear of my job. You guys were there, you know what happened. This is not right. Decisions were made that led directly to that disaster, and even if Mr. Pierce's family gets a settlement for millions of dollars, where does that leave the rest of us? This isn't a local issue, this is a nationwide issue, and you guys are in the spotlight for a brief time. You guys could make some noise that would affect change for all of the rest of us. I understand why you don't speak up, I have mouths to feed, too, but what are you defending? Just Google "landfill slide". It's just a matter of time...

From the very beginning many of us have feared that it will all be settled with a fine and everything would be swept under a rug. I know that the employees are afraid of losing their jobs, no union-no protection, PA is an at will state. And these folks have families and aren't earning a lot of money as it is. The whole mess is just so sad because a life was lost, and it could have been many more.