PSP vs. PGC

[DS58]

Lately, I have noticed a lot of PCG Game Wardens pulling over vehicles on the highway.

What is the reason PGC is doing the PSP work.  Also noticed it in the paper today that the PGC aided in the fatal crash near the bus depot.

Just a question, do they not they have enough animal/game commission work to do??   They could start buy picking up the month old deer carcasses... 

[Polo]

 Perhaps the Police are shorthanded, and can call the PCG in if they are in the area to help out when needed.  Glad to see them working together and helping out.  Its so hard to get recruits nowadays.  I do wish the road kill was picked up and disposed of on a timely basis.  I also know PCG doesn't come out to dispose of rabid animals most of the time.  We had a rabid raccoon under our steps.  My hubby called the PCG.  They told him what to do.  My hubby had to get it with a snare, then put it in a cage, and shoot it.  Then had to bury it.  We then had to sanitize everywhere the coon had been.  Could be that the PCG is shorthanded, too.  This is just my opinion, take it for what it is worth, but I feel the Police and Game Wardens are not paid enough.  There are a lot of positions in the area that pay way more.  Hence, the shortage in these fields. When folks are risking their lives on a day to day basis, they should get paid for it.  You couldn't pay me enough to do their jobs.  

[DS58]

Polo I agree 110% but if a PGC truck pulls up behind me with lights do I have to stop???

[rnetzlof]

This nothing new. PSP have been assisting the game commission in enforcing game laws for a few decades. This mainly during the busy open game seasons. In return, game wardens (I guess they're called Wildlife Conservation Officers now) are deputized into the state police to pay back the hours the state police spent on game law business.

I say deputized. That was the case years ago. It may be that they now have police powers in their own right.  Same thing for fish wardens, whatever they are called these days. Remember that in PA, unlike many states, the game and fish commissions are two separate entities.

[DS58]

rnetzof,

Thanks, I was reading elsewhere that the PGC has the authority to enforce ALL laws in the state of Pennsylvania.

Beware the brownshirts are next !!!

[Bon]

2 hours ago, DS58 said:

Polo I agree 110% but if a PGC truck pulls up behind me with lights do I have to stop???

Yes!!

[fedup]

The old story was that the game warden did not need a search warrant like the police. 

??????

[Polo]

5 hours ago, DS58 said:

Polo I agree 110% but if a PGC truck pulls up behind me with lights do I have to stop???

As Bon said earlier, yes!    I would stop.  

[Polo]

2 hours ago, fedup said:

The old story was that the game warden did not need a search warrant like the police. 

??????

Not sure about that one.  I think you may be right.

[dubois_15801]

6 hours ago, fedup said:

The old story was that the game warden did not need a search warrant like the police. 

??????

They need warrants just like any other officer.   But just like any other officer, if they see a crime take place, they can act on probable cause.

Game Wardens have full police powers in PA just like the State Police and municipal police.  They can also issue tickets for vehicle offenses.    All officers of the law in PA are officers also when off duty, and have powers state wide.   Yes, your DuBois police officers have the same power of arrest if they visit Philly on vacation as they do within the City of DuBois on duty.

The Game Wardens, State Police, and municipal police aren't the only type of police in PA either.   There are sworn rail police, elected constables(and their deputies), DCNR police(rangers), and a few others - all with full police powers.  It is just their primary duty is to a specific thing or area - but their powers extend beyond.

PA sheriffs really aren't police in PA(except in Allegheny County).  They are more of a bailiff/bounty hunter than officers of the law.  They only have the same powers of arrest as you and I.  ...for when there is a warrant for the person, when you witness a breach of the peace, or when you believe a felony has occurred.

[rnetzlof]

"Yes, your DuBois police officers have the same power of arrest if they visit Philly on vacation as they do within the City of DuBois on duty"

As my Son the Cop explained "I'm not a police officer because the city employs me. The city employs me because I'm a police officer and I'm a police officer at all times everywhere in Pennsylvania."

[buschpounder]

There are exceptions to an officer having police powers outside of their jurisdiction.  Some off the top of my head are if the officer is outside his jurisdiction but believes a felony was commited, or  the officer is in hot pursuit, or the officer has permission from the chief of that jurisdiction.

As far as the game commision: according to state law officers do not need a warrant, the property owner's permission, or even probable cause; they may enter private property and surveil hunters for potential violations of hunting laws, without restriction. Any landowners who refuse the officer's request can face up to a $1,500 fine and three months in jail.  

There is a law suit going on right now in Pa regarding this issue with a camp suing the state in Clearfield county.  

 

 

 

[dubois_15801]

On 6/29/2023 at 8:35 PM, buschpounder said:

There are exceptions to an officer having police powers outside of their jurisdiction.  Some off the top of my head are if the officer is outside his jurisdiction but believes a felony was commited, or  the officer is in hot pursuit, or the officer has permission from the chief of that jurisdiction.

As far as the game commision: according to state law officers do not need a warrant, the property owner's permission, or even probable cause; they may enter private property and surveil hunters for potential violations of hunting laws, without restriction. Any landowners who refuse the officer's request can face up to a $1,500 fine and three months in jail.  

There is a law suit going on right now in Pa regarding this issue with a camp suing the state in Clearfield county. 

Police in PA are empowered by the state, not the municipality.  They may be employed by a given jurisdiction or municipality - but their power is statewide.  There is a difference between empowered and employed.  A Brookville PD officer has the same power in DuBois as they do in Brookville.  ..Brookville just pays them to patrol Brookville.   That is how DuBois police can be called for backup in Reynoldsville - which has happened.   Or the Cherry Tree officer called to cover Rayne Twp, Manor Twp, Marion Center borough, etc, etc.   They just have an agreement between those municipalities to help PAY for the cost of coverage.   Heck, Brookville PD is the first responder LEO agency for the Pine Creek Elementary school in Pine Creek Twp.

The portion you mention about the game commission - that only applies to the Open Fields Doctrine, which also applies to regular police.  They still need a warrant to search and seize what isn't in plain view.   They cannot just go search your house, dwelling, or vehicle without warrant. 

All of us in PA, whether a police officer or a Joe Schmoe, has the power of arrest when we believe a felony has been committed, same with a breach of the peace that we have personally witnessed.

[buschpounder]

21 minutes ago, dubois_15801 said:

Police in PA are empowered by the state, not the municipality.  They may be employed by a given jurisdiction or municipality - but their power is statewide.  There is a difference between empowered and employed.  A Brookville PD officer has the same power in DuBois as they do in Brookville.  ..Brookville just pays them to patrol Brookville.   That is how DuBois police can be called for backup in Reynoldsville - which has happened.   Or the Cherry Tree officer called to cover Rayne Twp, Manor Twp, Marion Center borough, etc, etc.   They just have an agreement between those municipalities to help PAY for the cost of coverage.   Heck, Brookville PD is the first responder LEO agency for the Pine Creek Elementary school in Pine Creek Twp.

The portion you mention about the game commission - that only applies to the Open Fields Doctrine, which also applies to regular police.  They still need a warrant to search and seize what isn't in plain view.   They cannot just go search your house, dwelling, or vehicle without warrant. 

All of us in PA, whether a police officer or a Joe Schmoe, has the power of arrest when we believe a felony has been committed, same with a breach of the peace that we have personally witnessed.

Police do have power state wide but I believe the also have to follow the guidelines listed in title 42, section 8953 which is the statewide municipal police jurisdiction.

The open field doctrine may also apply to police but the Pa state police don't abuse the power or even take advantage of using the power unlike the game wardens.

[chris]

The PGC officer witnessed the Accident happened and was first on scene  to asset everyone involved and helped the fire Department Deploy Hydraulic lines for the jaws of life